AMD launches Ryzen AI 400 desktop processors with up to 50 TOPS NPU and Copilot+ support

[Worgarthe]

Doesn't matter though, because Intel and AMD have made a decision (or so it seems), which is that they have no interest in that, and instead want to sell the good iGPUs only soldered into laptops, mini-pcs, probably because they make more money with it. It's all about the money again ...

The whole comment is true and accurate, you said it all well, but the answer to this is simple - because cheap dGPUs for desktops will still outperform anything that an iGPU can offer. For less money.

The old RX 7600 is 231€ brand new in the EU (Germany), and it is noticeably faster than the B390: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Radeon-RX-7600-vs-Arc-B390-Panther-Lake-iGPU_11600_13268.247598.0.html

If you up your budget to 360€, you get the 9060 XT with 16 GB VRAM and even more performance over the B390: https://www.notebookcheck.net/Radeon-RX-9060-XT-vs-Arc-B390-Panther-Lake-iGPU_13070_13268.247598.0.html

So for desktops, you can save tremendous amounts of money - which you won't spend any time soon on the electricity difference by going with a 100-150W TGP dGPU (because those dGPUs idle at 0.5 to 3W and they work at full TGP only in full load, usually in gaming, but if you game 20 hours per day then you have other problems in your life, I'd argue) - and still completely wipe the floor with the B390 (or any other iGPU), plus get far greater CPU performance (also for less money).

A desktop about 2.5x faster than the X9 388H + B390 is also not just upgradable for the future but also about 45% less expensive (which you can use to get a beautiful 27" 4K/FHD dual mode 240/480 Hz display, and still have a lot of money left). Sure, you can't carry a desktop around but then getting an expensive iGPU for desktop to get less performance than cheaper dGPU - matters even less. It's easy to put an iGPU in a laptop, but the same is not possible with a desktop GPU (eGPU setup as the only option).

[Now you know]

No. You don't have to calculate anything. Performance is roughly known already.

Time Spy scores of the fastest G-series CPU, that were measured years ago, have been quoted in the same post. But the calculation aligns pretty much exactly with the bandwidth. So now you at least know that 96 GB/s is the maximum iGPU performance one can expect and going beyond 12 CUs wouldn't make sense ;-)

because cheap dGPUs for desktops will still outperform anything that an iGPU can offer. For less money.

As I have shown in my previous post indeed. But, ok, here more concrete:

• The 8700G costs 270 and achieves 3300 in Time Spy (12.22 points per price).
• The RX 7600 costs 280 and achieves 10450 in Time Spy (37.32 points per price).
• The RX 9060 XT costs 440 and achieves 14602 in Time Spy (33.18 points per price).

This is 3 times the FPS per price for the RDNA3 RX 7600 dGPU (and still 2.7 times for the newer RDNA4 RX 9060 XT dGPU) and you can upgrade it.

I don't really consider 6400 MT/s as fast. More like 9600 or at least 8533.

Sure, 9600 MT/s exists, but CAMM2 needs to come to desktop motherboards first. The question right now is does higher MT/s values lead to such high latencies, that the 1% and .1% FPS lows suffer?:

YT/Just Josh tested the Asus ExpertBook Ultra Panther Lake laptop (youtu.be/jduWl1J_4lQ?t=637), but what is up with the 1% FPS lows? He even points it out. Looking at the results, all Panther Lake Arc B390 are affected:

Cyberpunk 2077 (1920x1200, High settings):
ProArt PX13 (RTX 4060 | 95W): 91 FPS 1% lows
LOQ (RTX 5050 | 100W): 53 FPS 1% lows
ExpertBook Ultra (Intel Arc B390): 44 FPS 1% lows
Zenbook Duo (Intel Arc B390): 45 FPS 1% lows
XPS 14 (Intel Arc B390): 36 FPS 1% lows

The LOQ doesn't look too good either.
Now I wonder about Panther Lake' 10% lows, too.

[Prassel]

because cheap dGPUs for desktops will still outperform anything that an iGPU can offer. For less money.

First of all, most people are fine with a game, as long as it looks "OK". You don't even need a midrange card like RTX 4060 or 7600 to have a AAA game look "OK". There are countless comparisons showing that there is almost zero graphical difference between low and high settings in a game, especially games from the year 2020 upwards.

Next thing is, that the majority of people still use 1080p monitors. An iGPU like that from Panther Lake can easily deliver good graphics on that, even on new AAA titles.

Next thing is: when you can get CPU+iGPU in a single package, especially with a tile-based design - logic says that this package should be cheaper than producing a separate CPU and a separate GPU (the GPU even requiring its own board, RAM, cooler, etc.). It should be that way because of requiring much less resources.

Such an "APU product" would require less resources, cheaper to produce, tile-based-design allows either iGPU or CPU focus, easily upgradable on the same socket, thus more sustainable, and a very small environmental footprint once disposed. As a result it actually should be cheaper than separate solutions for CPU/GPU. The fact it's still not cheaper in price but even more expensive, only shows you that there is something wrong with the companies, and that the world ticks the wrong way.

[Walls of text]

You don't even need a midrange card like RTX 4060 or 7600

You don't. But I would really beg and plead with you not to go any lower than this. This is 5 year old $400 base PS5 performance. It should be the minimum standard from now on. Not just about running today's games but future heavy UE5 games, GTA 6, and etc. We don't want to be investing in e-sand silicon here, something which starts struggling within the next 6-12 months even with upscaling.

AMD now plays the same §hitshow as INTEL
...
Now people (especially AMD supporters) can really see both companies use the same tactics and don't care a f... about them.

Oh, I know. It's a complete mockery. Don't need to even look at igpu performance to see that. The fact that whenever AMD launches there 6 core desktop CPUs they charge $300 for them. Then when they don't sell at all after several months later finally drop the price.

One of the reasons why people pray arm takes over despite its issues. There's barely any competition rn.