Quote from: yuio on September 25, 2020, 19:08:03How come they didn't know this when they made the survey... Disappointing.

Sometimes ODMs just don't know exactly what they are dealing with. They need to gauge the market demand first before they do any serious investigation into technical feasibility. There was also the assumption that in anything goes wrong, they could count on AMD's support who could just make it work.

QuoteI wonder if it was money or threats behind the decision.

(https://download.schenker-tech.de/media/reaction/white-guy-blinking.gif)

See Hanlon's razor.

Quote from: yuio on September 25, 2020, 19:08:03All OEMs have their balls in someone's basket and are only allowed to release laptops with crappy panels and bad thermals in combination with AMD CPUs.

Bad thermals? Have you seen XMG CORE with AMD?

Cheers,
Tom

Nooooo :(( now I have to wait for the next iteration

How come they didn't know this when they made the survey... Disappointing.
I wonder if it was money or threats behind the decision.

All OEMs have their balls in someone's basket and are only allowed to release laptops with crappy panels and bad thermals in combination with AMD CPUs.

It's clear that I'll build an AMD desktop, no chance to buy a good AMD laptop.

Rather disappointing to hear that those Samsung OLED displays have "reached the end of its mass production cycle", because I was planning to get an OLED laptop with whatever is the upcoming laptop graphics update. I'd rather settle for a current gen laptop with OLED, if that is the choice I'll have to make...

So, Ryzen laptops are incompatible with OLED PWM trash, that's even more reason to look for an AMD laptop.

That was an interesting read, thanks Tom.

Quote from: heffeque on September 25, 2020, 11:14:11Personally... it seems like a lame excuse.

But it's the truth.

Quote from: heffeque on September 25, 2020, 11:14:11Either VIA is modifying the driver/HW support to the extreme, or it makes no sense whatsoever.

Not sure what you mean. The panel just does not show any picture. The TCON of OLED panels is widely different from any other LCD due to the built-in anti-burn-in magic and previously non-standardized HDR functions.

To give you some insight, I will share an article I wrote about this very panel back in 2019. It's slightly off-topic but it will demonstrate to you why OLED is complicated.


Why does Samsung ATNA56WR06 OLED-Panel only support Intel graphics through MSHybrid?

This is because Intel is using a proprietary standard for HDR. NVIDIA and AMD are using VESA standard instead.

The TCON of the Samsung ATNA56WR06 is following Intel's proprietary standard and it cannot be reconfigured to support both.

NVIDIA is working together with Samsung on a 2nd generation of this panel which would reconfigure the TCON to support VESA instead.

But then this 2nd generation would only support NVIDIA and AMD gaphics (VESA), but not Intel.

Theoretically, there could be a 3rd generation of this panel, using a TCON from a different vendor (Novatech) which could detect the GPU during boot (using the GPU OUI) and reconfigure itself during boot-up to support either Intel or VESA standards.

Currently it is now know if Samsung will go this route because it involves a lot of R&D. But maybe other OLED panel vendors will take this route from the beginning.

So there might be a future where OLED will support switchable graphics (MUX) again, but probably not in 2019.


Why does Samsung OLED not support G-SYNC or other variable refresh-rate standards?

It's because of panel-intern image quality and pixel lifetime algorithms, like:

• Picture quality compensation algorithms which can detect variances in the voltage of each sub-pixel, sense the amount of degradation over time, and compensate electrically.
• Temporal peak luminance control which will gradually lower brightness on a still image after 2 minutes
• Logo Extraction Algorithm which can detect a fixed logo, such as a network logo on a screen and reduce the brightness of the logo.

These algorithms require some frame caching and they need to know exactly when the next frame is going to come. GPU-driven frametimes with G-SYNC or VRR would throw them off.

Currently there is no panel in the market with OLED and VRR, although LG has announced one on CES: http://www.lgnewsroom.com/2019/01/thinq-ai-and-alpha-9-gen-2-processor-deliver-whole-new-user-experience-to-lg-tvs/

It remains to be seen if Samsung or other OLED panel vendors will update their image quality and pixel lifetime algorithms to support VRR in the future.

Cheers,
Tom

Perfectly fine, OLED is still not a good fit for laptops anyway.

Personally... it seems like a lame excuse. Either VIA is modifying the driver/HW support to the extreme, or it makes no sense whatsoever.