Quote from: GeorgeS on October 08, 2025, 20:35:22

Quote from: A on October 08, 2025, 03:24:58MS wants to sell cloud services, so they need people with online accounts so they can sell these things. It works as I know some people got onedrive which they never bought before until they already had an online account.

Quote from: UnkleM on October 07, 2025, 11:56:34If true this is disgusting behavior from Microsoft.
I was going to stick around because of visual studio, despite the ever increasing bloat. This might well make me pull the trigger on switching to Linux or even Mac.

Mac isn't that much better, if anything it can be worse. You need apple's online account to do stuff like use the store and other things. On top of that Apple is known to cut off software support much earlier, the shortest Mac had just 3 years of updates with longest being 8 years with average about 5 years. And Macs are a lot more picky about not letting software run on older versions. You even stop getting browser updates

Unlike Win11 (which might actually be able to run Win3.1 programs) OSX/MacOS can be rather picky about which version of the OS an application/driver set was made for.

At one point Apple decided that they no longer wished to support 32bit code/apps/drivers. Then there's the whole Intel/Apple-M thing.

However I'd rather guess that much like IE/Edge, it is rather questionable at best if anyone actually uses 'Safari' beyond finding and installing an alternate browser.

Well we don't need to guess, safari on desktop is 5.69% according to statcounter while mac is 12.21%, so almost half still use it.

Do remember that Apple far more forces you to use their own stuff. Just like if you develop on mac, you gotta use safari to debug webview for ios.

So yeah, if anyone wants long term updateable stuff and not planned obsolescence, one should stay away from Macs

Quote from: A on October 08, 2025, 03:24:58MS wants to sell cloud services, so they need people with online accounts so they can sell these things. It works as I know some people got onedrive which they never bought before until they already had an online account.

Quote from: UnkleM on October 07, 2025, 11:56:34If true this is disgusting behavior from Microsoft.
I was going to stick around because of visual studio, despite the ever increasing bloat. This might well make me pull the trigger on switching to Linux or even Mac.

Mac isn't that much better, if anything it can be worse. You need apple's online account to do stuff like use the store and other things. On top of that Apple is known to cut off software support much earlier, the shortest Mac had just 3 years of updates with longest being 8 years with average about 5 years. And Macs are a lot more picky about not letting software run on older versions. You even stop getting browser updates

Unlike Win11 (which might actually be able to run Win3.1 programs) OSX/MacOS can be rather picky about which version of the OS an application/driver set was made for.

At one point Apple decided that they no longer wished to support 32bit code/apps/drivers. Then there's the whole Intel/Apple-M thing.

However I'd rather guess that much like IE/Edge, it is rather questionable at best if anyone actually uses 'Safari' beyond finding and installing an alternate browser.

MS wants to sell cloud services, so they need people with online accounts so they can sell these things. It works as I know some people got onedrive which they never bought before until they already had an online account.

Quote from: UnkleM on October 07, 2025, 11:56:34If true this is disgusting behavior from Microsoft.
I was going to stick around because of visual studio, despite the ever increasing bloat. This might well make me pull the trigger on switching to Linux or even Mac.

Mac isn't that much better, if anything it can be worse. You need apple's online account to do stuff like use the store and other things. On top of that Apple is known to cut off software support much earlier, the shortest Mac had just 3 years of updates with longest being 8 years with average about 5 years. And Macs are a lot more picky about not letting software run on older versions. You even stop getting browser updates

Currently I have a "renewed" Lenovo T490 with Win11P inbound. I was actually debating if I was going to allow it to BOOT Win11 or simply swap out the SSD for an empty one in which I'd toss a Linux distro (likely Mint/Mate) on it or wipe & install on the Win11P SSD.

Surely, while hacked apart Win11 CAN be usable for native applications that don't run as well (or at all) on Linux.

However the 'rentalware' nature of Windows where MS can add/remove programs/settings & change the GUI and user settings whenever they wish MIGHT in some courts be frowned upon.

MS is simply flexing its "Monopolyistic Muscles" here and surely not enough of the right folks seem to care about it. :(

Quote from: Alexander_ on October 07, 2025, 18:10:58

Quote from: UnkleM on October 07, 2025, 11:56:34even Mac.

And you will update programs only manually?

Sure, why not? If and WHEN updates are needed.

While my MAC's CAN be updated 'automatically' the updates CAN BE TURNED OFF or used manually. Even Apple allows its users to HAVE A CHOICE.

again, hahaha!, running out of new builds? hahaha!

Quote from: Amelia20 on October 07, 2025, 19:23:15All of this feels like a push to collect more personal data,

Well, those Pentagon contracts and hundreds of unit 8200 veterans have to be put to good use, I guess.

running out of new builds? hahaha!

All of this feels like a push to collect more personal data, force users through ads, lock them into cloud services, and restrict their choices. There's absolutely no reason an online or registered account should be required.

Quote from: UnkleM on October 07, 2025, 11:56:34even Mac.

And you will update programs only manually?

I wonder what ratio of their userbase is actual end home users, because I think most of their value lies in entreprise space anyways, and they are definitely not gonna loose that because of the local accounts (at least not for long). Couple players/xboxers/endusers will not change much. Look how aggressively they increased the pricing of xbox subscription, and there are no riots or exoduses. Sometimes I wish the masses punished such behaviors, but it will never happen on this scale...

They're destroying their hobbyist user base, the only people who promote Microsoft software, the ones who staff IT departments, the ones who bought xboxes, the users that actually care about Microsoft. And the ones who sign up for MS cloud services, by the way.

So what's the plan here? Burn bridges with all your fans as you lose install footprint due to AI? Microsoft software can benefit from AI, but MS license profits cannot. And if they don't cultivate fans, partisans, loyalists, who will stick with them when someone else's AI can get the job done without MS Word, Excel, Visual Studio and SQL Server?

Microsoft's fight against privacy by local user accounts is its most disgusting behaviour ever.

If true this is disgusting behavior from Microsoft.
I was going to stick around because of visual studio, despite the ever increasing bloat. This might well make me pull the trigger on switching to Linux or even Mac.

Glad I moved to Linux. This bs is only to force people to give more details, to force to go through adds, lock you into their cloud storage, and bully you around. There is absolutely no need to have an online or registered account.